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crossing autoflower with regular

what happens if you cross an auto with a regular (non-auto) strain?-

toddzilla
Member
Ganjapussy
New Member

You can’t clone autos. Because they flower on how old they are instead of switching to “flower” if you clones a auto, the clone with flower the same time resulting in waste of time.

If you cross, the % of auto gene goes down. You can do it. But there’s a chance it won’t auto flower

seanel
Active Member
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
pmumbry
Active Member
pmumbry
Active Member
Ganjapussy
New Member
Jogro
Well-Known Member

Photo x auto crosses supposedly start and finish flowering a little earlier than the photo parent, and will likely be somewhat larger than the auto parent. Supposedly yes, they will flower with a little more light than the pure photo parent would.

I can’t answer the question about whether or not they’ll flower specifically under 16 hours of light. I just don’t know the answer though I’m speculating that its possible and might depend on exactly which photo and auto you’ve crossed.

The reason you haven’t is that auto plants can’t be maintained in “mother” form to generate clones.
Yes, you can take a cutting from an auto and root it, but the clone will mature just as fast as the mother, and when the mother is done, so will the clone be. There is no advantage to taking such a cutting; the net effect is just to reduce your overall yield without maintaining the genetics you’re after.

Well, depending on what you’re trying to accomplish, it can take that many crosses to create a “pure” autoflowering version of a standard photoperiod plant, though in practice, very few breeders really go that far, and you can get most of the way there in quite a few generations sooner than that. I don’t think this is what the original poster was asking about, though.

I don’t believe this is correct.

Since the most common autoflower gene is recessive, it requires TWO copies (one from each parent) for any offspring plant to be autoflowering.

If you cross an auto with a photoperiod plant, each of the offspring will only carry ONE copy of the autoflowering gene (from the auto parent) and you would expect NONE of these F1 offspring to be autos.

If you then crossed two of these F1 plants to create an F2 generation, you would expect ONE QUARTER of the ensuing F2 generation to be autoflowering.

And if you then crossed two AUTOFLOWERING F3s (or an autoflower F3 with any other auto) you’d expect all of those offspring (or nearly all) to be autoflowering.

Just curious if the plant would flower under 16 hrs. of light, be larger than the auto parent, or what one might "generally" expect from this cross? Another…

Breeding with Autoflowering Cannabis

Takeaway: When it comes to breeding cannabis, autoflowering is one of the most basic types of genetic traits of the plant, as it follows the laws of simple recessiveness and dominance. Specifically, it is a recessive trait. A brief review of high school biology reveals how it all works.

Cannabis normally requires long dark periods to trigger flowering, but there are varieties that will flower regardless of the lighting conditions. These are known as autoflowering varieties. Not all cannabis traits are as simple to explain, which is part of what makes autoflowering a good example for beginning breeders to start with.

For the purposes of this article, a few exceptions and special cases have been omitted for clarity, since even at the most basic level, it is a complicated enough topic that to some may seem confusing at first.

Gregor Mendel, a friar who conducted experiments with pea plants in the mid-1800s, tracked traits such as seed shape and flower color, and developed basic rules for understanding genetic inheritance such as the concept of dominant and recessive traits.

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What is Autoflowering?

Autoflowering seeds are available from seed retailers. Although some traits are complicated and require more than one gene to express, autoflowering is one of the most basic types of genetic traits and follows the laws of simple recessiveness and dominance. Specifically, it is a recessive trait. (Read Weed Seeds: When to Choose Regular, Feminized or Autoflowering.)

Of importance to breeders, both experienced and aspiring, autoflowering is an easily observable simple Mendelian recessive trait. It is generally quick and easy to determine if a given adolescent plant is autoflowering or standard just by keeping it in short (or non-existent) dark periods for a few weeks. If the plant stays in growth, it is standard. If it flowers it is autoflowering.

Chromosomes From the Male Plant

Cannabis is a diploid, in other words, it gets one chromosome from the pollen of the father, and one from the ovum of the mother. This means it will have two genes (one from each chromosome strand), each of which can be one of two alleles, either autoflowering or not.

If we refer to the photodependant (standard) allele as P (upper case P), and the non-photodependant allele as p (lower case p), then the child plant will receive two—one from each parent. If the father is true breeding (homozygous) for photodependancy, it will have the allele P on both genes—the same is true for the mother.

Seeds made from such pairings will result in offspring that is also true breeding for photodependancy. The father will contribute either a P or a P (because he has two big Ps, and will pass on one or the other). The mother will contribute either a P or a P (because she has two, and will pass on one or the other).

While technically there are four combinations possible, effectively it doesn’t make much difference because all of the combinations result in PP (true breeding for photodependancy). This is why breeding a standard cannabis plant with another standard cannabis plant will result in standard cannabis offspring. The same is true of autoflowering.

True Breeding Marijuana Plant Parents

If both parents are true breeding for autoflowering, they will each have pp, and their offspring will autoflower (since they will receive a p from each parent). However, if one parent is PP (standard) and the other is autoflowering (pp), then all of the seeds will be Pp, since they will get one of the two P from the first parent, and one of the two p from the second parent. Having both the allele P and the allele p (heterogeneous for autoflowering) makes them a hybrid.

Since they have the alleles for both photodependancy and autoflowering, their phenotype (physical expression) will depend on dominance. Dominance determines which one breaks the ties in these instances.

In this case, photodependancy is dominant, so the resulting Pp seeds will all be photodependant. This is why the first generation after crossing a true breeding standard plant with a autoflowering plant will create seeds that are photodependant and will not autoflower.

Autoflowering Traits in Hybrid Seeds

However, the hybrid seeds aren’t useless. If the heterogeneous seeds from the above are crossed together, then the autoflowering trait will reappear:

  • The hybrid father will contribute either his P or p.
  • The hybrid mother will contribute either her P or p.
  • The resulting combinations are either PP, Pp, pP or pp.
  • The PP will be true breeding for photodependancy, and will show photodependancy.
  • The Pp and pP will be heterogeneous for photodependancy but will still show photodependancy because of dominance.
  • The pp will be true breeding for autoflowering, and will show autoflowering.

It is important to note that because of dominance there is no way to visually tell the difference between PP, pP and Pp. They will all be photodependant—only the recessive pp from this generation can be easily identified as true breeding.

A practical experiment can illustrate the above:

Step 1: Take a standard cannabis plant and cross it with an autoflowering variety. It doesn’t matter which supplies the pollen as long as one is male and the other female.

Step 2: Grow out the resulting seeds. They should act as if they were standard seeds. Select the best male and at least one female and cross them together.

Step 3: Grow out those seeds under growth (no long dark period) lighting. Due to the reasons explained above, there should be about 75% that don’t autoflower and 25% that do. The more seeds planted, the closer the results should be to the 75%-25% ratio.

One benefit to breeding for a recessive trait is that all of those that autoflower would have been true bred for autoflowering and can be bred together to make more autoflowering seeds. (Read Do my autoflowering weed seeds need additional nutrients?)

Even if a breeder isn’t fond of autoflowering varieties, the process and learning experience of working with them can help expand their understanding of how genetic traits work in a way that is easy to see and will give tangible results and feedback.

Applying Mendelian genetics to simple traits in the real world can not only help cement an understanding of the basic principles of genetics, but can impress onlookers when predictions are proven accurate, or at least reasonably close.

When it comes to breeding cannabis, autoflowering is one of the most basic types of genetic traits of the plant.